Interview with Nelson Mandela, by Senator Legarda

MANILA, Philippines—In 1997, new South African President Nelson Mandela visited the Philippines and then 37-year-old TV journalist Loren Legarda got an opportunity to interview him. The following is the transcript of the interview aired on ABS-CBN on March 4, 1997.

Loren Legarda (LL): How has it been like during your stay here in the past few days and what would you consider the highlight of your visit here?

Nelson Mandela (NM): Of course, the reception that I have been given by President Ramos, by President Fidel Ramos, has been tremendous and I was struck up by his simplicity and, of course, his achievements in the household both in the Philippines and abroad. I was also happy to meet Corazon Aquino again. When she came to South Africa, I hosted her in my official residence. That is a lady who has been able to turn a family tragedy into a triumph. Not only for her family and the Filipinos, but for the entire world, she was able to show as a role model that it is not the disaster itself. It is the way in which, you respond to that disaster. That lady is one that I highly respect very much.

 

LL: You were at the forefront of the struggle against apartheid. How was it like during those many years of struggle and incarceration?

NM: Our struggle is not something that is very easy. It has broken many otherwise very powerful and courageous people, and our struggle was no exception. But sometimes we are not just and fair. Too many people who were involved in the struggle were sacrificed, much more than some of us. And secondly, I do not think that I would have survived without the tremendous sacrifices that were made by people inside the country and supporters from the entire world. Few people can deny that the struggle in South Africa brought a lot of suffering. Many lost their lives and many were imprisoned, many were punished, many lost their loved ones, their land, their dignity and without them, it would not have been possible for us to win. And we won and were able to stand the most painful experiences because we were not alone.

 

LL: What provided you the guiding light during these very dark years? It must have been difficult having gone through this.

NM: Well, with us, both inside and outside prison, it was a collective leadership. There are many men and women in our organization, past and present, and I’m sure in the future, who put together the ideas and are able to guide every single individual who was part in the struggle. Alone, I would never have been given a leadership.

 

LL: Mr. President, with the establishment of a free, multiracial democracy in South Africa came the problems, economic, social, and political problems, protests, poverty, increasing crimes, and they say that political violence were eradicated but other kinds of violence, criminal violence, soared. How are you dealing with these problems?

NM: That is a very important question, which is caused by a genuine concern of some of South African visitors. We have an efficient minister of security. We also have an efficient minister of defense. What is going on, in terms of wiping out crimes, we have done very well in the past two and a half years, having inherited a problem which was out of control. We are getting on top of it and we are confident that in due course, we will be able to eliminate all of it.

LL: You are in the middle of your term and you’ve mentioned time and again that you will not seek reelection in 1999. How would you guarantee that your successor would continue your economic, political and social reforms?

NM: Men and women come and go but the organization remains. It is the organization, not the individuals. We have this guarantee in collective leadership that every individual will not act on his own. He will be guided by the national executive committee of the organization and the tradition of collective leadership. We have fine, younger men than myself, who are talented, who are skilled, who are courageous and who are experienced. I have no slightest doubt that nothing bad will happen. If at all, the organization will even be in a better position to deliver services after I stepped down.

 

LL: You don’t consider yourself indispensable to the party and the government?

NM: No. No. No. No. If you had a peep to our discussion on leadership, you will see that in the debates that take place, many of my colleagues are head and shoulders above me and, therefore, overruled me on countless occasions and I had to retreat because I take a stand…

LL: Mr. President, your second deputy president, F.W. de Klerk, withdrew from the coalition government last year. How does this speak of your leadership? I understand you had some differences about the constitution and majority rule. What are the repercussions of this withdrawal and this opposition to your government?

NM: Mr. F.W. de Klerk has made South Africa a better world because it would not be possible for us to have this peaceful transformation if he had not committed himself to that peaceful transformation. He made it easy for us. Whatever mistake he made in the past, but from the point of view of ensuring that we have a bloodless transformation, he set South Africa on the path to a better world. South Africa will never forget the contributions that he made toward a peaceful transformation of our country.

LL: Looking back now, Mr. President, what do you think are the lessons of the past?

NM: Well, it is very difficult to talk about the lessons of the past but as to how our country is concerned, we are not only able to crawl out of the painful past, of tension, conflict and bloodshed, and in which a human being is slaughtered, merely to preserve a system that is morally wrong. And we are now building a new nation. We call it a rainbow nation because foes have now become friends and the rifle is now being literally replaced with songs.

LL: Mr. President, there have been unofficial reports that you will not complete your term [in] office and would probably step down?

NM: No. I will step down as the head of ANC (African National Congress) at the end of this year. But not as president of the country.

LL: Of course, you will continue.

NM: Of course, I will continue and step down at the end of my term in 1999.

 

LL: What do you plan to do in your retirement?

NM: Well, my next plan is to stay next to the road and beg for gifts and presents.

LL: Well, we know that you’ve not kept secret your special relationship with your special companion. Would you care to say a few words about it?

NM: I would like to share my feelings with you but, of course, my cultural background does not allow me to discuss such questions with someone who’s young enough to be my granddaughter.

 

LL: Sorry, I just had to ask that question because Filipinos are very romantic at heart.

NM: (Laughing) No, I appreciate that.

LL: No wedding bells for you in the future? No wedding plans?

NM: Better to ask her.

LL: I’d like to.

NM: She will make her decision.

LL: Thank you. It’s been a great honor and a pleasure to meet you.

NM: You’re welcome. Thank you. Thank you.

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